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My intent here is to spread the word about something I learned last week from my recent contact with the Nevada Department of Motor Vehicles concerning max weight ratings and driver testing.
In Nevada, a tow vehicle and 5er combination weighing over 26,000 pounds Maximum Gross Combination Weight Rating requires a Class-A license.Note I did not say a CDL.That’s fine.I already knew this.
However, something I really hadn’t thought about that I learned last week is this.When you report for the yard test and road test for the Nevada Class-A, they enter the VIN of both vehicles in your combination into their computer system that searches for the “Manufacturer’s” specs which includes all maximum weight ratings of your vehicles.
If you’re pulling a 20,000 pound MGVWR trailer with a truck that has a MGVWR of 13,000 pounds, you may think you’re fine if both truck and trailer weighs less than these ratings.You can actually be under both max vehicle ratings and max trailer weight rating, and still be overweight on the Maximum Gross Combination Weight Rating by as much as 2,000 pounds.
If this is the case, the Nevada DMV will disqualify your combination vehicle from being used in testing due to being overweight based on the ratings alone.Keep in mind, they don’t care what’s on your placards.They go by the information returned from their VIN search.My guess, and it’s only my guess, is the placards would be in agreement with the information returned by this search unless the placards have been tampered with.And that’s probably why they don’t even look at the placards.
From my research, if you’re driving a GM built 3500 dually up to the 2019 models (MGVWR of 13,000 pounds and MGCWR of 31,000 pounds), and pulling a 20,000 pound trailer, you’re overweight by 2,000 pounds based on the ratings alone, and your rig will be disqualified from being used for testing.No Class-A license for you today.
The 2020 models of the GM built trucks have a MGCWR of 40,000 pounds and an increase from 13,000 to 14,000 pounds MGVWR.In which case, you may be fine in the example above.There’s only a rather small increase in the unloaded weight of this truck.I was surprised.
I also asked the lady at the Nevada DMV for the statute (NRS) reference for defining being overweight in case of being questioned by a Nevada Trooper.She just referred me to the Nevada Highway Patrol.She didn’t deal with that.
Keep in mind that the Nevada DMV uses the “Ratings” returned from the manufacturer, not what’s on your placards or your scale slips.The DMV doesn’t care if you’ve weighed it or not.It seems reasonable to me that most, if not all states would perform similar searches as Nevada before testing.
I would suggest considering and matching vehicles by ratings first.Ratings, ratings, ratings!Then determine if you can load without busting any weight ratings.Do this before throwing down a fist full of dollars.
A manufacturer may increase a rating for your truck with some modifications applied, but unless the new rating is returned from a search by the DMV, you may still have trouble.
In your search for a proper tow vehicle to pull the trailer you have, or want to buy, think it through from the beginning and use the information that’s available.Remember, there’s nothing cheap about RVs.Make good decisions from the start.
Winnebago TT 2101DS & 2020 Silverado LTZ Z71. 300 watts WindyNation solar w/MPPT, 2 Trojan T-125s. TALL flag pole. Prefer USFS, COE, BLM, USF&WS, NPS, TVA, state/county camps. 14 year Army vet-11B40 then 11A - old MOS 1542 & 1560.
Texas didn’t do that. My CGVWR exceeded 26,000 lbs so I was required to get a class A (I am a 5th wheel). Using your Nevada standards, I would still be OK ... I wonder how long it will be before other States do similar.
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Ron and Janice
2016 Ford F350, King Ranch, DRW, 4x4, CC, 6.7 PS Diesel, remote control air lift system
2017 Durango Gold 381REF, Lambright furniture, MCD shades, morRYDE IS, 8K Disc brakes, GY G114 LR H Tires, 27,320 lbs CGVW
I think they are so happy in Texas that people come in to get the right license that they aren't too worried about the combinations when it comes to 5ers.
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Barb & Dave O'Keeffe
2002 Alpine 36 MDDS (Figment II), 2018 Ford C-Max HYBRID
Another reason why Nevada checks the weight numbers is testing for a particular class license requires the use of a vehicle in the class of the license you apply for. And they don't trust the placards. If the vehicle doesn't meet the class requirements, you can't use it for testing.
I stopped by the NHP barracks yesterday, Saturday only to find they were closed on the weekends. Really? Yep. Oh well, I'll be in that part of town again next week and plan to stop in for a chat.
FWIW, all the new dually trucks have increased their GCVWRs. Prior to 2019, GM trucks were only rated for 23,000 GCVWR ... so only those trucks would be impacted by the Nevada approach. GM has now “fixed” that deficiency. Ford and Ram had 30,000 plus lbs GCVWR for several years but GM lagged behind. But the ratings are all now very similar. But ... there is a red flag in there. If you buy a 3 year old Chevy, you might be caught up in that insufficient GCVWR trap. A 3 year old Ram or Ford will be fine.
-- Edited by RonC on Sunday 10th of November 2019 03:08:50 PM
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Ron and Janice
2016 Ford F350, King Ranch, DRW, 4x4, CC, 6.7 PS Diesel, remote control air lift system
2017 Durango Gold 381REF, Lambright furniture, MCD shades, morRYDE IS, 8K Disc brakes, GY G114 LR H Tires, 27,320 lbs CGVW
I think they are so happy in Texas that people come in to get the right license that they aren't too worried about the combinations when it comes to 5ers.
I wish they all would get the right license AND the right truck. Too many SRW 1 tons (and unbelievably 3/4 tons) pulling 15,000 lbs (and heavier) 5th wheels that it’s scary. Not wanting to be the weight police, but also not wanting to be anywhere near them on the highway as they go by, blissfully ignorant, at 70 mph.
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Ron and Janice
2016 Ford F350, King Ranch, DRW, 4x4, CC, 6.7 PS Diesel, remote control air lift system
2017 Durango Gold 381REF, Lambright furniture, MCD shades, morRYDE IS, 8K Disc brakes, GY G114 LR H Tires, 27,320 lbs CGVW
that is only true if you live in Nevada,or make a few other states but Not here in Arkansas. I could pull my Cedar Creek with my class 8 Kenworth if I still had it with my Class C. DL
-- Edited by Danny and Cheryl on Sunday 10th of November 2019 08:57:34 PM
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2005 Cedar Creek 30RLBS/RV Flex Armour Roof / MORryde Independent Suspension/ Disc Brakes
Understand that the DL required are all over the place, but the safety issue of towing overweight remains. Physics remains a truth no matter what you want to believe. Safety is more important than politicians decisions, who are woefully uninformed.
-- Edited by RonC on Sunday 10th of November 2019 10:48:29 PM
-- Edited by RonC on Sunday 10th of November 2019 10:49:11 PM
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Ron and Janice
2016 Ford F350, King Ranch, DRW, 4x4, CC, 6.7 PS Diesel, remote control air lift system
2017 Durango Gold 381REF, Lambright furniture, MCD shades, morRYDE IS, 8K Disc brakes, GY G114 LR H Tires, 27,320 lbs CGVW
Now here's another thought. The common, general rule of thumb seems to be if a driver is legally licensed and/or endorsed in the state issuing the DL, he would be considered legal in other states. But if he's driving a Class-A vehicle, combination over 26,000 pounds, but only has a Nevada Class-C DL endorsed for no more than 26,000 pounds, he isn't legal in Nevada. If he drives into a state that does not require a Class-A, and in which he might be legal if he were licensed in that state, is his Nevada license valid? Could he be cited for not having a proper license?
I don't know, but I seem to remember hearing or reading that if you're legally licensed and/or endorsed for the state issuing your license, you're legal in other states. But in the situation above, the driver would not be legal in Nevada. Therefore, he likely would not be considered legal anywhere and could be cited. Might it be that in order to be legal anywhere, you must be legal in the state of issue regardless of local requirements, or lack thereof?
This is another question I'm going to try to remember to ask when I stop in at the NHP barracks this week. Hummm!
Personally, I have no problems with DL requirements. I only have a Class-C endorsed to 26,000 pounds now. But I plan to have a Class-A before my vehicles are delivered in January. I had a Class-A CDL years back and I'm already fully aware of the safety issues involved in operating a heavy vehicle. Not everyone is. At least the testing introduces you to some of the more important safety issues.
Now here's another thought. The common, general rule of thumb seems to be if a driver is legally licensed and/or endorsed in the state issuing the DL, he would be considered legal in other states. But if he's driving a Class-A vehicle, combination over 26,000 pounds, but only has a Nevada Class-C DL endorsed for no more than 26,000 pounds, he isn't legal in Nevada. If he drives into a state that does not require a Class-A, and in which he might be legal if he were licensed in that state, is his Nevada license valid? Could he be cited for not having a proper license?
I don't know, but I seem to remember hearing or reading that if you're legally licensed and/or endorsed for the state issuing your license, you're legal in other states. But in the situation above, the driver would not be legal in Nevada. Therefore, he likely would not be considered legal anywhere and could be cited. Might it be that in order to be legal anywhere, you must be legal in the state of issue regardless of local requirements, or lack thereof?
This is another question I'm going to try to remember to ask when I stop in at the NHP barracks this week. Hummm!
Personally, I have no problems with DL requirements. I only have a Class-C endorsed to 26,000 pounds now. But I plan to have a Class-A before my vehicles are delivered in January. I had a Class-A CDL years back and I'm already fully aware of the safety issues involved in operating a heavy vehicle. Not everyone is. At least the testing introduces you to some of the more important safety issues.
I'm sure you are correct about being "legal" in your home state makes you legal in all states ... and vice versa, if you aren't legal in your home state then you aren't legal in any state. SD doesn't require any special license so operating in TEXAS is just fine on a SD class C.
All of this is pretty academic because unless there is some reason to check your license (accident, speeding) then nobody is likely to ever check your drivers license. But if there is some reason to be checked, with the wrong license ... effectively you are driving without a license.
-- Edited by RonC on Monday 11th of November 2019 01:40:01 PM
-- Edited by RonC on Monday 11th of November 2019 01:43:12 PM
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Ron and Janice
2016 Ford F350, King Ranch, DRW, 4x4, CC, 6.7 PS Diesel, remote control air lift system
2017 Durango Gold 381REF, Lambright furniture, MCD shades, morRYDE IS, 8K Disc brakes, GY G114 LR H Tires, 27,320 lbs CGVW
You know you're right Ron. It really is academic most of the time. But I just thought I'd throw out there the little bit I learned about the testing process from the DMV last week that some may find helpful in selecting a tow vehicle. There are a few who may actually put forth the effort to match capabilities before buying a heavy combination rig. And that would make the roads safer for all of us, proper DL or not. I've actually seen a big truck go into a runaway gravel pit. That must surely be a terribly intense five seconds.
Thanks Dave ... your offering this bit of knowledge is very helpful for those who are trying to figure this whole towing thing out. I knew that GM one tons were rated to tow much less than Rams and Fords, but since I was a ford guy, it really didn’t sink in. Your shedding light on this subject is good for all of us ... Thank You!
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Ron and Janice
2016 Ford F350, King Ranch, DRW, 4x4, CC, 6.7 PS Diesel, remote control air lift system
2017 Durango Gold 381REF, Lambright furniture, MCD shades, morRYDE IS, 8K Disc brakes, GY G114 LR H Tires, 27,320 lbs CGVW
I'm sure you are correct about being "legal" in your home state makes you legal in all states ... and vice versa, if you aren't legal in your home state then you aren't legal in any state. SD doesn't require any special license so operating in TEXAS is just fine on a SD class C.
All of this is pretty academic because unless there is some reason to check your license (accident, speeding) then nobody is likely to ever check your drivers license. But if there is some reason to be checked, with the wrong license ... effectively you are driving without a license.
Ron: Above is correct - If legal in the state that issued your DL then you are legal in all 50 states naturally assuming your residence doesn't change.
Further, and I suggest beyond safety, this is the key point: If one is driving an RV requiring Class A (Non-CDL) license with only a Class C - as an example - then one is driving without a driver's license. If one had any type of "event" one can most likely forget about any insurance or liability coverage as one was driving illegally. It could also be viewed as criminal liability. It is what it is.
All states are different and one has to be very careful about reading in the License Handbook that RV's don't need a CDL. True, but a CDL and a Class A or Class B license are two different points. There are, in some states, as an example, Class C ("automobile / van") - CDL licenses. The CDL part (commercial operation) is independent from the weight class - trailer class part. That's a large error on some people's part, especially RVers and RV sales people who say otherwise.
In my state I am legal to drive, for example, an 80,000lb semi-tractor trailer with my Class A if I own the rig and use it totally for private use. But I am not legal if I am paid to drive it or haul anything. Paid is the CDL part and the CDL test has additional sections - both written and operation to pass the test in my state as an example. "It depends."
Lots of threads discussing this on the forum over the years.
