A friend just bought a 2002 Foretravel and is very happy. Foretravels are definitely high end units. My in-laws have a 2001 Monaco Dynasty tag axle unit and are also pretty happy. Once you go used you can find some nice units. We did buy our 2004 Dutch Star new Norm and Linda Payne have the same floorplan we do in a 2005.

Most mid to lower end motorhomes use a frame rail chassis and this includes all gas ones. This includes the Spartan used in my Dutch Star, all Freightliners, and many other products. Given enough time a frame rail chassis will loosen and flex and will not drive as well as when it was new. Ten years will show some impact, but there are many frame rail motorhomes that are 20 years old out there still doing fine.

Most higher end motorhomes and true buses are monocoque chassis, where parts of the walls add to the stiffness of the chassis, this includes Country Coach, Newell and Foretravel. If you are in it for the long term, decades really, then monocoque is the way to go. But you pay for it. If you want a really huge engine, over 450 hp or so, then I would recommend a monocoque chassis since it adds stiffness you need to deal with the twist that big engine is putting on the frame.

Alpine Coach makes its own variant chassis that has about the best drive experience for a motorhome. But their quality has not always been good, so look closely. We almost bought an Alpine instead of a Dutch Star.

How many air bags are on each axle makes a big difference in ride and how the motorhome handles curves. That means no air bags is worse.

CAT and Cummins both make good engines and there are plenty of places to work on them both. Some high end motorhomes use Detroit Diesels, which is common in real buses. At the same horsepower the Cummins normally has an edge on torque over a CAT, so it will climb hills just a bit better. A 350 to 400hp engine is a good match for motorhomes less than 35,000 lbs. Side radiators are better and above about 350hp they seem to be required.

Why is a motorhome feeling better for you? What is appealing to you about the ones you like? How do you intend to travel? Will you need the RV usable with the slides in? Do you need slides at all, if not you can get some incredible deals on older very well made motorhomes. Have you looked closely at storage both above and below? Are you going to dry camp much?

Most like dark cabinets when they look at RVs and then many dislike them when they have to stay inside in dreary weather since it is so dark. To others they still like the warm look of dark cabinets even in dreary weather. This is just an example where each of us has a different opinion.

Welcome Bruce glad you joined .

Here's my take on it, Its about personal choice and budget. Personal choice is, how comfortable you and especially your spouse feels in it. And budget is what you want to afford and can. 

We have gone from a 34ft Class A to a 40ft Fifth wheel. Our decision was made after researching (forever) and actually living in the motorhome for 2 months, it became quite clear that we wanted more room, higher ceilings, more cabinet storage and pure living space, those were our main considerations.

When looking at the larger DP'ers 40'+, one thing kept sticking out, they all looked the same ! (low flat ceiling front to back) Drivers area takes away quite a bit of actual living space and no matter if you looked at a Newmar King Aire or at the Dutchstar the only real difference was opulence and price (sure I know ,there are chassis and engine differences) But when you come down to it, it was still just a box on wheels with a big expensive engine pushing it.

We looked at Fifthwheels when visiting the various "RV SHOWS" but like you, could not find one that impressed us, we kept comparing them to the big diesel pushers overall quality.

We also had our budget to think about, should we go into debt with a DP or be debt free +++ with a 5'ver and a pickup ? 

After some sleepless nights I went to look at a new Dutchstar, while I was there I stopped in to look at a Newmar Torrey Pine fifthwheel, instantly I was converted ? It had everything we had been looking for, room ,solid suface counters ,high ceilings and all solid maple cabinets that stretched all the way to the ceiling, its was huge ! Called my wife and and we made a trip back to dealer.

I showed her the Dutchstar (nope), the London Aire (your kidding right?) and the King Aire (Heck NO, $700K), then I showed her the Torrey Pine, and to quote Linda Payne " I could live in this" Well that was easy :)

We have now made our first quick trip in it (600 miles) and could not have wished for more, the towing was great ,hitching up and unhooking is a non-event. Ours did not come with a generator prep but after a lot of research and recomendations, we decided for us, a pair of small honda 2000's are all we would ever need (they are still in the boxes).

Our plan is that this setup should last us at least ten years (our last one we owned for 8 years) total out of pocket for the 2008 5'ver and 2008 superduty was around $115k.  The Dutchstar and a toad was going to be around $255k. This made the decision easy for us (budget) .

But it all really boils down to what you and the spouse want to live in.

-- Edited by ken and cindy at 10:54, 2007-09-04

-- Edited by ken and cindy at 11:04, 2007-09-04

Thank you all for your thoughtful replies! I will try to answer some of the posed questions and add further elaboration. I posted here because I saw the quality of responses and the group has impressed me with friendly insight offered.

First I should state that I believe we have 5 Must have features in anything we select as follows:
1) King bed - I am a big guy and I love my wife, but if we are going to live here long tern there is no flexibility on this issue, we need the room.
2) Comfortable shower - As already stated I am a big guy. I need some room in there to get clean. Usually this dictates the shower that is in the bedroom area as opposed to with the throne in a small room.
3) Computer desk - I plan to actually work in the unit. I would assume love seats can be removed and a desk added if need be, but it is a eventual must.
4) Space for the cat litter - we will take 2 cats with us. I see many people have pets so I know it is doable, I just need to ensure we have somewhere better than the living room floor for the litter box. Has anyone ever made a pass through to the basement to solve this issue? Can it be done?
5) Usable kitchen - I like to cook and expect to continue doing so. I am sure many people never use more then the refrigerator, but I plan to cook. I am a little surprised that I have yet to see a magnetic induction cook top in a MH.

After that I am open.

Darrell, thanks for the fifth wheel brand suggestions. We kind of looked at them as afterthoughts, so I have no idea what brands we saw. But I think I saw mostly lower end units. We live in a nice home that is well appointed and if I am considering this for full time living then I expect the same. It will be enough of a shock going from 3500 sq ft to a RV.

Bill, I already feel like I know you due to your posting history. I hoped you would chime in here to help with some technical stuff. I was wondering what a monocoque was and why it was good. Air bag count was another uncertainty (do these bags ever rupture?), and what was a big enough engine is another issue I had no idea how to judge. I am an engineer by degree and will strive to understand it all. How about elaborating on a tag axle. I see some units with similar carrying capacity without one, so why is it good. It looks to me like it would make the unit more stable on the road and less resistant to wind sway, but I read a post by someone who claimed a tag axle was just a substitute for putting in a properly designed axle to start with.
As to why a Motor home feels better, I suspect it is because I walk in and they have leather sofas, wood cabinets, and nice flooring. I have these things in my current home and that is what I expect will make me happy in the long run. My wife laughed when I stretched out horizontal on the sofa, but the travel supreme felt comfortable.I have yet to see a leather sofa in a fifth wheel, or even a fabric I would find acceptable. I have seen linoleum floors in them and particle board cabinets, so they have not impressed me so far. They probably have these options, but I have not seen it in my very limited looking.
By the way I like light cabinets and interiors as they make it feel roomier to me, so that will not be a problem. From pictures of the dutch star I have seen it seems they have vents in the floor down the center, are they all like that and do these ever bother you.
Your point about slides is interesting and well taken. I like them as they make the unit larger, but heck I could afford a newell without slides. Quality is very important to me so in the end I will weigh the decision. To put this in perspective, we bought a Lexus again this year without really shopping for much else. Why? Because past experience and industry surveys make me feel certain we will not have a problem with that car, and I don't think It will ever leave my wife stranded on the roadside. I know I can not afford the Lexus equivalent in a motorhome, but I want to try for it. By the way if we go with a motorhome we will probably tow that car in a trailer, so there is another requirement.

Jon, thanks. I am still confused about hot water options and what is a name brand and what is a generic type of system. Seems some use on demand heaters and others use tanks. We are only beginning the search, and we will look until we find the right unit. I think used is a good value, but the lack of slides in some units is a major functional change.

Ken, I will look hard. My wife is less picky than I on much of this stuff. I want to like the 5th since it is clear I could be close to 100K richer if we went that way, and we all know cash is king in this lifestyle. On the other hand to give it a fair chance I need something that will be comfortable to start or how will I like it in 6 months. As stated above a am a big guy (6'3" 300#) and part of changing lifestyle is a effort to reduce stress and change myself to a healtier me. But as a lifetime member of the big guy club, you have an eye for quality that most people never experience. Thinks like how much a sofa sags, or if a chair feels like a leg is going to break off if I lean the wrong way. Even how sturdy a floor feels when walking on it, or does a step have flex. On one 5th it seemed less that the step was flexing than the frame it was attached to!

Having only looked at a few places so far I am sure we will find more products to our liking, but when the salesman kicked on the generator and turned on the air conditioning in the Travel Supreme Select and as we sat and chatted comfortably, I thought "I could live here". To any salesmen reading you should take heed of that. The allegro may have been nice, but the chemical formaldehyde odor burned our eyes so bad we looked and ran out. And as for 5th's, we kept going out to talk to avoid the sweltering heat inside.

So now my next big question? We would like to rent a unit for a week or two to try out. I looked at the national agency's and they don't rent anything comparable to what I am looking at. Is there a resource where I can find private owners who rent there units? Does anyone have a friend between NYC and Wash DC who may be interested in renting a unit to us. I have found suitable rentals down south, but it seems silly to fly to the rental, and I have yet to find anything decent within reasonable distance of NJ.

Thanks for all your suggestions,
Bruce

-- Edited by brucedelta at 19:49, 2007-09-04

Motorhome Review Online

Note:  This information is from a website no longer on the www.  As a newcomer/wannabe to living the full-time RV lifestyle, I found this chart to be extremely helpful.  I make no claims as to its accuracy.  I am merely passing it along four your edification.  The LOWER the score, the better. Approximate date of this information is October of 2006.
This table was developed as a result of in-putting hundreds, if not thousands of  owner surveys.

Overall Quality                Fit and Finish                    Buy Again
    Manufacturer        Manufacturer        Manufacturer    
1    Newmar    1.533    Country Coach    1.43    Country Coach    1.30
2    Country Coach    1.57    Beaver    1.63    Tiffin    1.56
3    Beaver    1.63    Newmar    1.66    Newmar    1.58
4    American    1.64    Tiffin    1.83    Beaver    1.67
5    Tiffin    1.76    American    1.86    Four Winds    1.75
6    Four Winds    1.88    Western    1.94    Alfa Leisure    1.85
7    Western    1.88    Four Winds    2.08    American    1.86
8    National    2.02    Winnebago    2.08    Western    1.88
9    R-Vision    2.06    Safari    2.14    R-Vision    1.89
10    Winnebago    2.06    National    2.15    Coachmen    2.08
11    Coachmen    2.08    Itasca    2.19    Safari    2.08
12    Forest River    2.09    Coachman    2.23    Damon    2.15
13    Safari    2.14    Alfa Leisure    2.25    Winnebago    2.19
14    Itasca    2.15    Forest River    2.27    Monaco    2.25
15    Fleetwood    2.16    Monaco    2.33    National    2.25
16    Monaco    2.19    Fleetwood    2.36    Fleetwood    2.30
17    Alfa Leisure    2.20    Damon    2.38    Forest River    2.32
18    Holiday Rambler    2.27    Holiday Rambler    2.41    Rexhall    2.34
19    Damon    2.33    Harney    2.42    Holiday Rambler    2.49
20    Rexhall    2.40    Rexhall    2.47    Itasca    2.62
21    Georgie Boy    2.44    R-Vision    2.50    Georgie Boy    2.93
22    Harney    2.46    Georgie Boy    2.72    Harney    3.40
Ave        2.12        2.04        2.15

Foretravel was the only manufacturer with a perfect score, earning a 1 in every category.  

I hope this helps.  Sorry about the formating.

George

Don't know if you're interested but a friend of mine has a 2003 Travel Supreme Select for sale. Check it out at:

http://www.buysell.com/root/detail/BC/2003_Motorhomes/4496/64219662/42_FT_LUXURY_DIESEL_pusher_c_w.aspx - -

There are links in the post that will send you to places where the Moho is listed for sale.

Sandra

Bruce,

You've correctly identified the 2 seperate decisions that you need to make before finding your perfect new home.

The motor home / fifth wheel decision is the same as the stick house ranch vs colonial question. Neither one is better, they just have different positives and negatives.

The quality thing is very similar to your experience with boats, only magnified by 10. It sometimes seems that there are hundreds of brands to choose from. The problem comes for full timers in the fact that the industry caters to a customer base that is overwhelmingly made up of vacationers, who according to the RVIA, spend an average of only 31 days a year in their RV. Hence, there are a lot of attractive options to visually tempt you that probably won't stand up well to 24/7/365 usage.

Going to Hershey is about the best thing you can do to answer your ranch / colonial question. There are literally hundreds and hundreds of RV's to inspect, and you should be able to come away with a gut feel as to which you are.

The quality thing is a little bit more difficult. I would recommend finding out if any unit you're interested in is warranted for full time use, and it's carrying capacity ( after loading liquids ). You're probably going to want to add in excess of 3000#. We were suprised when we did the same as you at Hershey, how many manufacturers straight out told us their unit is not designed for full time use.

Lastly, I would join the RV Consumer Group and read their ratings on the type of RV your interested in. They represent the only independent view on the industry, similar to Consumer Reports, and will at least tell you the specific models to avoid.

Good luck, this is an exciting time.

Fred

-- Edited by Luvglass at 11:54, 2007-09-05

Bill, Thanks for all the answers and the link on the tech stuff. I Have devoured that site as they have much good info. The next think I need to understand is braking. What is a Jacobs brake vs exhaust brake vs air brakes vs disc. I obviously know some of the basic answers, but I am not sure what is desirable.

We will be staying in Hershey Fri and Sat nights, need to book a room today as a matter of fact since my wife just got the official word she does not have to go to Europe for business that weekend.

Sandra, your friends Travel Supreme looks very nice, but I must admit to being concerned about the brand, as it seems about the top end (price wise) for non-monocoque chassis and I never see anything about them on the boards. We will see on this front.

Fox river - thanks for the chart, it is a good starting point for names, and I do like the pusher web site.

I also agree the thought of driving a diesel dually around town as a everyday car is one of the thinks that makes me believe I want a motor home with a tow behind. I am not sure if putting the IS250 in a trailer is right or we should get rid of it for a toad'able car. We like the IS and are only 6 mos into a 36 mo lease, so it would be hard to get rid of, but we will see how fast the house sells.
We had a second agent in last night who suggested a listing price $150 K more than the first, so we need to get a 3rd and fourth I think. Our home is unique and hard to comp, but the difference through me. We have a home 2 doors up that sold for $1.2M in the last 30 months and 2 doors the other way sold for $300K during that period, they are very different obviously, so it makes comps hard.

We made contact with a local RV club member who invited us to a rally this weekend, and I think we will stop by.

I already had ordered the RV consumer group package. I do wonder how they get their data, that seems far from clear to me. I mean basically how do you get samples of all these units to rate? Are they owner reported ratings, or manufacturer reported etc. How consistent are the metrics if they are owner reported? It is not mentioned on their web site, but maybe the package will provide understanding, we shall see.

I am still looking for a rental as I would like to go to NC next month in a RV.

Thank you all for your input, I appreciate the candid feedback.

PS - for those with datastorm what kinds of speeds do you get. If you have never checked the site dslreports.com has a tools section with speedtests.

-- Bruce

-- Edited by brucedelta at 15:58, 2007-09-06

The DataStorm was our one "splurge" when it came to full-timing. Since we use the web to research almost everything we do, we felt it was worth it to us to have simple, dependable access whether we're in a park or out in the boonies somewhere. We expect to boondock a lot, so it's also an "investment" in that it will let us save park fees and still have Internet access.

We're very happy that we made the decision, but as Bill says, it depends on how it fits your budget. If you're not a big Internet user or you're going to be in quality parks all the time, the "investment" may not return.

As far as performance, we consistently get over 800 kbps down and 150 kbps up. We were used to cable, and honestly, it's rare that we notice we're not on cable anymore, so for practical purposes, it's as fast as anything you'll see anywhere. We were in a park last week that had Wi-Fi, but it was only running at around 200/200, so we were really glad we had our dish!

I saw Susan and Ricks coach before and it does look just about perfect for what we want. It is the right layout with a desk and king bed, and I loved the flooring the first time I saw the pictures. For their sake I hope they sell it before we are ready to pull the trigger, but if it is still on the market then I will make a trip to see it. I am thinking that Spring is our time frame for realistically selling the house.
It is interesting that I can find many mentions of Newmar owners loving their rig, I do not get the same sense for Travel Supreme. They are also absent from the above list posted by Fox River.
I always go down the path of wanting to find out what is the best and why. Then I can make a choice on where to sacrifice. Cost is a concern, and buying used is a concession to that right off the bat since I know I can not afford what I want new. For about the same price of this 2003 TS, I could get a 1998 Prevost or a 2000 Newell, etc. I just want to be aware of what choices I am making and understand them, I realize I will not get perfection in a choice I can afford.

Do all diesel engines have one of these braking systems. I notice they are frequently mentioned, butt not always. For instance Susan and Ricks copy makes no mention of any braking system. Is it possible they do not have one?

As for Datastorm, I should have put it on the must list but I assume I would add it to any coach I bought. I assumed the download speeds are fine, but really wanted to know about upload speeds. I may even keep my aircard and the datastorm for redundancy, I will have to decide if the $600 a year is worthwhile.

I must admit I am learning much from discussing this.

Dear Bruce,
Welcome to a very informative and supportive community. My husband and I are in our early 40's, don't have children and began fulltiming in April. We work a business on the road and also workcamp to make ends meet. Although we never rv'ed before becoming fulltimers, we knew we could live in a small space together and not kill each other. We researched for 2 years before buying our rig and taking the plunge. I so encourage you to please rent a RV before you buy one. I know they won't be comprable to what you will want to fulltime in, but at least you will have the experience of seeing how well you do together in a confined space, making decisions on where to go and park, learning the systems, and just getting a general feel of life on the road. Please make sure you both are on the same page on making this life decision. Giving up a house and possessions is emotional. Be prepared for that. (But it so worth it in the end)

I suggest that you look at a New Horizons 5th wheel. When you described your ideal rig, I looked around ours and said check, check, check. We have solid oak cabinets, parquet floors, a designated place for the cat litter box (under the w/d unit, there is a cut out door for access for the cats, and outside access to remove the box for cleaning.I'll have to email a pic.) a full size shower that both of us can fit in if we sqeeze a little, a great office space, and a nice kitchen. Please look at www.horizonsrv.com. We bought ours used, but it was perfect for us. We just changed the interior to a leather sofa, recovered the dinette cushions, and relaminated the counters. It is rated as one of the highest quality units. If buying new, they customize to your specs. I can't say enough nice things about the company and our rig.

If you are going w/ a 5er, buy the rig and then match your truck to it, not vice versa. Hope to chat w/ ya again.

Nancy & Richard Lindsey
2001 New Horizons 34RLSSS (Toto)
2007 GMC 3500 Diesel dually (Oz)
"Music makes our wheels go round"

Another option if you go with the truck and 5ver, is do like Howard and Linda.  They have a Jeep Liberty that one of them drives while the other drives the truck with the 5ver.  They use walkie talkies to communicate while driving.  They seem to really like this set up.

Well we went to Hersey and have had some time to digest it all, so I thought I would report back. Basically spent 3 days there and to say it was exhausting would be an understatement. I think we got to most diesel pushers there and some other choices. We checked out 5th wheels and at this point I am pretty sure the class A is right for us.

So in no particular order here is what we saw.

Tiffan - I will start here since this is probably the most perplexing. I really wanted us to like the product because they are well thought of and they have nice layouts. Shirley was very turned off by our lack of ability to get the attention or information from anyone staffing the very large booth. I was turned off by the fact that every coach seemed to have small things broken that just did not seem apparent in others. Additionally I looked at the weight rating stickers on every coach where I could find them. Without the tag axle (most at this booth) the weight ratings showed a carrying capacity that dropped down to 1200# on an alegro bus. We were not able to have any discussion of the products with a sales rep nor did we find a brochure.

Newmar - We really liked the product here and I would have to rank a Duchstar 4317 as the leading contender for a new coach so far. I liked the factory people and what we saw on display. They offered test drives in a Kountry Coach with the comfort drive. Since this was my first ever RV driving experience I am not sure if the Comfort drive is revolutionary or not, but I did not crash the thing so that was good. There are some interesting new vs used issues here, but I think I will start a new thread for that discussion.

Travel Supreme - There is very little not to like about these coaches. They seem well built and have all the features one could want. The select may be a top choice on the used front, but I would probably take a Duchstar over a Alante new.

Alfa - If I was buying only layout I probably would have jumped at the rear bathroom model as it seemed perfect for us. They have done some different things but I am not comfortable with their decision to use basement air conditioning. I have my doubts that it can get the job done to keep the coach cool in hot weather, and it takes away allot of storage. They also clearly want to deliver a standard cookie cutter coach, and I did not like their exterior graphics/logos at all.

Alpine - Very nice product with many classy touches. I could see myself in a Alpine, but they are probably out of our price range. Since there was a major change in 2008 looks I am doubting a used unit would be a good fit due to the now dated styling.

Foretravel - Nothing wrong with these coaches. Price would limit me to looking at the used side, but I very well may do that.

Forrest River - Biggest disappointment. I do not think I could settle for a coach that did not have a CCC rating of at least 3000#, and I did not say any unit they had on display rated over 2000#, most were 1200 to 1600.

Monaco - I liked the Camelot ( I think ) and will have to revisit these as this is apparently the most straight on newmar competitor we saw based on price and apparent build quality. We have a dealer not to far, a trip may be in order soon.

Pacifica - Clearly not the desired build quality and craftsmanship I felt we wanted. They had the full wall slider on display and the layout was more family oriented than 2 people full timing.

Gulfstream (Travelstar I think) - Another booth where we got no attention. they were same dealer as Travel Supreme, so the next day when the travel supreme tried to close and I said I was not ready for that level expenditure he began pushing the gulfstream. I related the lack of customer service we experienced and he said management was aware of the issue the prior day and wanted it corrected. He then took us over and went through the product, but in reality I was spending more effort defending the full court press sales strategy than viewing the coach.

We saw some others such as tuscany and such, but none struck our fancy. Notably absent were Country Coach and Beaver, both of which I hopped to see. Additionally the lack of suitable lunch food was unfortunate.

We did look at the renegade and haulmark Super C class units and they were much nicer than expected. I am just not sure I see the benefit if we are not towing a horse or race garage. I may try to drive one of these to see if I like the ride any better. As they push the good ride these units offer over a class A.


The show did raise some interesting new vs used issues and I will spill my thoughts on another thread for that subject.

I thought that I'd add my two cents worth here.
We are not full timers yet, but we have been doing our research (going to RV shows, dealershps, etc...) for about a year or so now.

We have also gotten a great deal of information from this site, as well as other sites/forums, such as the Escapees forum, etc...
I will say that the folks here are extremely knowlegeable for everything RV and are happy to share and give great advice.

It is absolutely correct that there seems to be two distinct groups of "full time" RVers. Those that decide to go with Motorhomes, and those that decide that a fifth wheel is a better choice.
We have pretty much decided to go with a fifth wheel for the following reasons:

1. Although we've literally looked at hundreds of (both) motorhomes and fifth wheels, the
absolute bottom line for us is, a fifth wheel has much more usable living space.
It's like a little mini-condo on wheels...
For us, the motorhomes we've looked at are simply too small.

2. We, like you Brucedelta, have a list of "must have" items we want on our future RV home.
Also, like you, a King Size bed is a MUST for us. We have had a King bed for years and
years in our "stick house" and this is simply something we want to have in an RV.
I would say that probably 98% or more of the motor homes we have looked at, only
have a Queen Sized bed (or smaller)...
We have found that only "some" of the top/high end motor homes have King Beds
options.

3. Also, about 98% of all motorhomes we have looked at have the main TV situated
above the drivers compartment (which is pretty much the living room area - there is
only a "curtain" that is pulled across the windshield/drivers compartment for privacy
which we really don't like. The TV situated in this position is (in our opinion) not a
good place for viewing. It tends to make us have to crank our necks in an unnatural
way, and which seems would be really uncomfortable.
1. Although, there are a (very) few floor plans that offer a TV mid-way in the living
area....again, this is only on the most high end units.

4. Another issue for us is, for the most part, motorhomes have a "booth-type" dinette
area (which is not a good setup for "big guys" in my opinion). A "free standing dinette"
is another MUST have for us.
Again, free standing dinettes are available, but mostly in the higher end units.

5. We found that workmanship/quality is just as good (or better) in the higher end fifth
wheels as in most all (except the absolute top end...$1,000,000.00 units) motorhomes.
Higher end fifth wheels have excellent quality cabinets, Corian or Granite countertops,
quality carpeting or a huge variety of top quality flooring options.
Some of the units were are considering are:
A. Double Tree - Elite Suites or Mobile Suites
B. KZ Escalate pr Tory Pine
C. Peterson Industried - Excel
D. Newmar - Country Aire

6. There is a LOT more headroom in fifth wheels as opposed to motorhomes.

These are some of the reasons why we have chosen to go with a fifth wheel. Most of the top end fifth wheels have an MSRP of somewhere around $100,000.00 or so (and we have been told by several "previous" RV salemen that we should never ever pay more than 75% of the MSRP on a new fifth wheel....or motorhome for that matter). We haven't found
a motorhome that was at all acceptable for us of under a minimum of about $250,000.00 of so, which is a lot more than we want to spend (and even with these top end units, there really isn't much difference in most floorplans...) Obviously, a nice used unit would be cheaper.

As has been said here, this is really a personal choice, and everyone's different... the thing that intially caught my eye was your initial post of a King Sized bed as a MUST.
Although my wife has always been "sold" on a fifth wheel, I have tried my best to find a motorhome that I really like, and has the room and living space that I would feel comfortable living in......I just haven't been able to find one.

There are obviously Pros to choosing a motorhome:

1. User friendly when traveling
2. Ability to pull a "toad" so that you don't have to rely on a large tow vehicle to drive
as an only vehicle.
3. Ease of setup in inclemment weather (although I have heard many fifth wheel owners
who dispute this).
4. More comfortable ride when traveling.
5. Sitting up higher when driving.

Just to name a few.


So these are just some of the things that have led us toward choosing a fifth wheel over a motorhome. It is a personal choice, but it is wise to really do some research and see as many different kinds of RV's as possibe so that ultimately, you will make the right choice.
I thought you might be interested in some of the things that we've found in our search so far.

Good luck on your search, and maybe we'll run into each other out there one of these days.


Rick and Debi
Future Full Timers

I agree there are so many pros and cons toward both fifth wheels and motorhomes that the debate could go on forever.  It really depends on what you personally want.  Neither is right or wrong and everyone has their own personal reasons for purchasing what they do.
We almost bought a fifth wheel, a Mobile Suites or Elite Suites.  The thing that kept haunting us was the truck needed for towing this size unit.  We just could never get a comfort zone with the size truck we would have to purchase and would become our transportation when parked somewhere.  Everyone should read the article in  www.dmbruss.com.  Go to the sidebar marked "safety" and read the article called "a sad story."  It is an eye opener.  We just didn't want to drive a big truck. The weight was always an issue for us.
Many new floorplans in motorhomes now offer the living area in a different location and thus the TV is no longer always up front.  These are not always the high end motorhomes either.  I think the motorhome industry is trying to give the consumer more options.  I know the kingsize bed is more common in a fifth wheel but there are some motorhomes that have those also. 
The bottom line is that this issue is personal.  A pro for me may be a con for someone else.  It is not an easy decision, if it were, there wouldn't be so much discussion on it.
Good luck on your search.  It is an important decision for you and your wife and one that you have to be happy with and live with.  It is really no different than searching for a sticks and bricks.  There are millions of different houses with different floorplans in different locations.  Our house will sell when someone comes through and we have what they are looking for.
We are all still full-timers and that is what matters most.

A couple items regarding motor homes. Air suspension is pretty important. 4 bags would be the minimum, the more the merrier. Safari started using air bags in '99 and I had a pac brake on a '95. Harney is a dead Safari line.

Beaver is rarely mentioned on this forum but look at the "fit and finish chart" and find that Beaver and Safari do well. Beaver had 8 bags and a "Jake Brake" in '98, I have one. Look at a 5 year old Beaver, you will be surprised.

Safari (Magnum Chassis) built the chassis for Safari and Beaver until about 2002 when they were acquired by Monaco. Alpine does their own chassis as does Country Coach and current diesel powered Monaco brands. Western RV ( Dolphin and Tradewinds/Islander) also build their own. Most diesel coaches have some pass through basement storage.

Initial fit and finish is very important but even more so is manufacturer warranty and service. I would consider that a major fraction of the decision. While most major brands do pretty well in this department I quit looking at a couple of brands after reading the dis-satisfaction of their current owners. Check with owners and see how well they support the "previously loved" coaches.

Seriously consider a used coach, no sense in losing the big bucks in depreciation. You can also thank the first owner for getting the bugs out. A king bed and computer desk are easily added.

Mike