We are also in Elkhart and will be at MoRRyde next Tuesday for ailment and inspection after 18 months on the road fulltime, it will be our first time there

I think we'll make an annual swing thru here for wheel bearing repack and check up. They already have the old axles off and the brake controller installed. I did verify that we're getting 8K axles and brakes👌

RonC wrote:

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I think we'll make an annual swing thru here for wheel bearing repack and check up. They already have the old axles off and the brake controller installed. I did verify that we're getting 8K axles and brakes👌

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 FWIW, that's what we do.  I let MORryde do a yearly re-pack and inspection.  One can do this themselves but if there is anything wrong the tech will find it and many times it's repaired under warranty.  As long as I see no abnormal wear on the tires I typically don't do a re-alignment unless Sergio sees something that might need attention.

If one travels, IS or not, these suspension systems receive a lot of wear and tear on the bad roads including interstates and a yearly inspection is not overkill IMO.  Just good PM.  And is normally the case at MORryde, an appointment is really an appointment for service.  Not an appointment to "get in line" for service as with many places.  We've been delayed once or twice but it wasn't their fault.  People before us had major problems due to rig overloading and the anticipated work was much more extensive to fix frames, etc. once the cracks were discovered.  Happens more often then one might expect - hidden on-going issues from overloading that are discovered at inspection time.

Bill

Bill ... yep! that's how I see it too. Let them look everything over once a year to keep things in good order. Rob says "Hi".  Gary did give me a tour ... very impressive.

-- Edited by RonC on Tuesday 8th of August 2017 02:07:58 PM

Not sure where Gary is now. My tour with him was last week during the KZ National Rally ... he had a family issue that required him to be out of town at the end of last week, so I don't know where he is now.

-- Edited by RonC on Tuesday 8th of August 2017 09:00:05 PM

Bobc wrote:

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We are also in Elkhart and will be at MORryde next Tuesday for ailment and inspection after 18 months on the road fulltime, it will be our first time there

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 We got our rig finished today and are now camped in the Elkhart Campgrounds. You will be impressed with MORryde.  They are impressive as a Company, how they treat their employees and how they behave toward the community.  Ask about the little house on the property, that just about tells you all you need to know about the company.  OBTW, they make awesome products.

-- Edited by RonC on Friday 11th of August 2017 04:57:39 PM

Many companies have trouble with that "do the right thing" part. Normally it goes off the rails when the bottom line gets too important, shareholders often drive that. As long as mor/Ryde remains a privately held company, they can preserve the values the owners chose. In this case, it was "do the right thing" ... it's what makes mor/Ryde exceptional.

RonC wrote:

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I have a question for those with experience with adding the morRyde IS. I know it adds weight ... you can just look at what goes on and what comes off to see this. I also know that the IS is unsprung weight (meaning that the frame doesn't have to "carry" that weight, but the GVW of the trailer has changed ... haven't gotten to a scale yet so I don't really "know" how much it's changed.  I was weighed by morRyde after (but surprisingly, not before) the installation wheel by wheel, but the trailer wasn't level and the total weight is unusable (as a wheel by wheel) because the front wheels were very heavy compared to the rear, so not usable other than for total weight.  Based on my last total weight and the new one from morRyde ... it looks like the total weight increased by 960 lbs.  It's reasonable to assume that each axle gained 1/2 of that so each "axle" went up 480 lbs. Does this jive with what you saw when the IS was added?

Thanks for any input

-- Edited by RonC on Saturday 12th of August 2017 08:18:46 AM

-- Edited by RonC on Saturday 12th of August 2017 08:24:31 AM

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That sounds really high, Ron. Sergio told us the 7K MOR/ryde system should add about 300 lbs. total to the unsprung weight. We found that it was closer to 425 total per the CAT scales. 

Rob

RonC wrote:

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Based on my last total weight and the new one from morRyde ... it looks like the total weight increased by 960 lbs.  It's reasonable to assume that each axle gained 1/2 of that so each "axle" went up 480 lbs. Does this jive with what you saw when the IS was added?

Thanks for any input

---------------------------------------------------------------------

MORryde would have done a wheel-by-wheel before and after if you had requested it.  But as you were going up to 8K what it was at 7K was pretty academic to them. If you had said you wanted to stay at 7K then they might have suggested a weighing to make sure 7K was acceptable.  That was a discussion we had when we had the first trailer converted to an IS.  It was a 7K trailer.   Wasn't sure if I needed 8K.  So Sergio weighted it.  Some discussion with the shop manager was going on with me RE: 7K vs. 8K, etc.  Sergio leaned over to Linda and said: "8K."  Linda leaned over to me, said "Sergio says 8K."  I said to the shop guy, "8K."  Not trying to make light of it but they would have done that had it been necessary or had you requested a 7K weighing, IMO.

As to the 480 / per axle total - yea that doesn't sound too far off to me.  Recall you went from 7K to 8K axles.  The IS 8K is bigger (steel sizes)  then a 7K IS and much bigger than traditional springs and axles.  Also you added disc brakes and "H" tires.  The "H" tires are heavier then "G" in themselves. It all adds up.  Recall those two big boxed cross members between the actual IS "axles" actually reinforce the frame.  Lots of steel that, as you correctly noted, is carrying its own weight along with the "H" tires, etc. None of that is on the frame.  Truck must pull that weight, but the trailer does not carry it.

My experience and opinion FWIW

Bill,

I did request it before ... when I asked the answer from the tech was "I forgot". I requested an "after" weigh and the rig was 3" low in the front (which I noticed after it was pulled out of the bay) and the weights reflect it ... very heavy on the front two axles and light on the two rear ones. Pretty sure the total weight is reliable so that's what I'm going on. You are correct that there is a LOT of metal in those assemblies ... impressive. They also welded a 4" and a 1" box riser tubes to make everything turn out right height wise. This adds strength at the frame to IS attachment area, so pleased about that. Rob told me that the rubber springs will "settle" about 1/2" after they've been in service for a little while. All that to say I'm OK with how level everything is, just need to get it weighed wheel by wheel so I'll know what tire pressures to run.

-- Edited by RonC on Saturday 12th of August 2017 03:41:18 PM

Second Chance wrote:

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BiggarView wrote:

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... Is 2765 lbs enough?

Brian

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...

We aren't the heaviest packers around - but we're not the lightest, either. We have right at 2,000 lbs. of personal stuff on board: four seasons of clothing, two computers, a guitar, food, usually about 100 lbs. of soft drinks and distilled water, etc., etc., etc. 

It's just my personal opinion, but from your numbers, I don't think you have anything to worry about.

Rob

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 Thanks Rob, hadn't considered the weigh of the IS and tire upgrade in that light.... Just saw absolute numbers and became concerned. Hopefully that leaves more room for solar and batteries.. LOL.

Brian

BiggarView wrote:

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Well that throws a kink into our upgrade planning. Our currrent top pick 5er weighs 13425 as delivered with a GVWR of 16850. So, with the IS upgrade to 8k and H tires we were looking at 18850 GVWR. leaving 5425lbs for everything else. Now if 960 lbs is lost to the upgrade... we're down to 4465 available. We've calculated 1700 lbs approx for solar, batteries, second ac, genny, W&D, Awnings and other optional gear. That leaves 2765 lbs for everything else.... clothing & linens, kitchen gear, food, water (80 gal), toys and other gear, tools and maintenance items, cleaning equipment and supplies, pet items, campsite items... have we forgotten anything? Is 2765 lbs enough?

Brian

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I am trying to understand this myself (I consider myself a pre-newbie since I have not bought an RV yet).  My understanding of GVWR is that regardless of what modifications you do to your rig, including increasing the axle weight rating, you can't increase your trailer's GVWR - only the manufacturer can do that - in your case it it would still be 16850.  So if you could carry 3425 lbs before the modification, than that is how much your trailer is rated to carry after in total weight (but now the axle sides would be better equipped to handle a heavier load on the sides.)  And your truck needs to be able to handle the extra towing weight.

RonC wrote:

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Bill,

I did request it before ... when I asked the answer from the tech was "I forgot". I requested an "after" weigh and the rig was 3" low in the front (which I noticed after it was pulled out of the bay) and the weights reflect it ... very heavy on the front two axles and light on the two rear ones. Pretty sure the total weight is reliable so that's what I'm going on. You are correct that there is a LOT of metal in those assemblies ... impressive. They also welded a 4" and a 1" box riser tubes to make everything turn out right height wise. This adds strength at the frame to IS attachment area, so pleased about that. Rob told me that the rubber springs will "settle" about 1/2" after they've been in service for a little while. All that to say I'm OK with how level everything is, just need to get it weighed wheel by wheel so I'll know what tire pressures to run.

-- Edited by RonC on Saturday 12th of August 2017 03:41:18 PM

---

 Then the tech didn't do everything you requested, but that doesn't impact accuracy of the installation. Those number wouldn't change what he did but would have been nice to know just to know them.  Totally agree on the wheel by wheel.  Based on experience, until I weighted the rig, I'd run 100 which covers the 4K max hub rating.  But that's just my opinion.  Here are the Goodyear published pressure chart numbers for the G114 tire so you can make a choice.  I would not run the max of 125 psi regardless.  Again, my opinion.  125 psi is for 4,806 lbs of load.  'Bit much for our rigs, and then some.

110 psi = 4,340 lbs  105 psi = 4,180 lbs  100 psi = 4,020 lbs   95 psi = 3,860 lbs  90 psi = 3,695 lbs.

vannchan wrote:

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BiggarView wrote:

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Well that throws a kink into our upgrade planning. Our currrent top pick 5er weighs 13425 as delivered with a GVWR of 16850. So, with the IS upgrade to 8k and H tires we were looking at 18850 GVWR. leaving 5425lbs for everything else. Now if 960 lbs is lost to the upgrade... we're down to 4465 available. We've calculated 1700 lbs approx for solar, batteries, second ac, genny, W&D, Awnings and other optional gear. That leaves 2765 lbs for everything else.... clothing & linens, kitchen gear, food, water (80 gal), toys and other gear, tools and maintenance items, cleaning equipment and supplies, pet items, campsite items... have we forgotten anything? Is 2765 lbs enough?

Brian

---

I am trying to understand this myself (I consider myself a pre-newbie since I have not bought an RV yet).  My understanding of GVWR is that regardless of what modifications you do to your rig, including increasing the axle weight rating, you can't increase your trailer's GVWR - only the manufacturer can do that - in your case it it would still be 16850.  So if you could carry 3425 lbs before the modification, than that is how much your trailer is rated to carry after in total weight (but now the axle sides would be better equipped to handle a heavier load on the sides.)  And your truck needs to be able to handle the extra towing weight.

---

You're correct about the GVWR... I misspoke... with the upgrade the GVWR "techniquely" stays at 16850. I have read several letters from the NHTSA to various inquirers on this subject and and they don't specifically prohibit such modifications to carry additional weight but such modifications to carry additional weight beyond the MFRs stated GVWR should consider the capabilities of the axles, tires and rims, brakes, frame, hitch pinbox and any other components that may affect load ratings. It's all somewhat confusing and a lot of what seems to be legalese shirking of culpability in the event of an accident. In the end it boils down to buyer beware... like any other product. Given Mor/Ryde's reputation and track record thus far, we feel safe. I'd certainly keep any paperwork from Mor/Ryde regarding the installed upgrades handy for any LEO or other bureaucrat that wanted to verify our specs.

I also believe that there is a "legal" path for re-certifying modified trailers but I am not versed in that subject.

I was comfortable with the modifications we desire to install with our expected loadout... until I read in this thread (and assumed incorrectly) that the IS, brake and tire/rim upgrade added 960lbs of weight that then subtracted from CCC. From that I made the error thinking that we might now be overweight because I failed to account for that extra 960 pounds. I correctly added it to the total trailer weight. If it turns out that we can't carry more than 3425lbs all in with stronger axles, tires, rims and brakes, then we may have to do some re-evaluating of our assumptions. I'm in contact with an owner of a similar unmodified unit but I can't make head or tails of his numbers which don't seem to gibe with published numbers from the mfr. I have started a dialog with the Mfr.  

Lastly, given the above numbers, we are fully comfortable that our future intended TV is well within it's capabilites with room to spare for the intended application.

I'm certain if I get any of this incorrectly, the pros round these parts will jump in to keep me on the straight and narrow. Like you, I want to understand this stuff as best as I can.

-- Edited by BiggarView on Sunday 13th of August 2017 08:14:44 AM

vannchan wrote:

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I appreciate the information from all in this thread. I am particularly interested in these topics of weight and capacity as my wife and I work our way to a final decision on which particular model to buy. I am already planning on upgrading the suspension (MORryde) and most likely will also have them put on the 8k axles as I think that would make provide me with a better margin of safety.

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John,

You want MOR/ryde to match the suspension system (7K vs. 8K, springs, etc.) to the actual wheel-by-wheel weights on your rig. I'll coin a phrase here and say that there is such a thing as being "over-suspended." That is to say, too much spring and tire capacity for the weight on the suspension system. This results in the springs not flexing (suspension doesn't travel up and down) and the tires being "hard" and not making full contact with the road resulting in a much harsher ride for the rig and possible metal fatigue and stress damage to the frame from repeated hard hits.

Rob

 

Bill and Linda wrote:

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RonC wrote:

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Bill,

I did request it before ... when I asked the answer from the tech was "I forgot". I requested an "after" weigh and the rig was 3" low in the front (which I noticed after it was pulled out of the bay) and the weights reflect it ... very heavy on the front two axles and light on the two rear ones. Pretty sure the total weight is reliable so that's what I'm going on. You are correct that there is a LOT of metal in those assemblies ... impressive. They also welded a 4" and a 1" box riser tubes to make everything turn out right height wise. This adds strength at the frame to IS attachment area, so pleased about that. Rob told me that the rubber springs will "settle" about 1/2" after they've been in service for a little while. All that to say I'm OK with how level everything is, just need to get it weighed wheel by wheel so I'll know what tire pressures to run.

-- Edited by RonC on Saturday 12th of August 2017 03:41:18 PM

---

 Then the tech didn't do everything you requested, but that doesn't impact accuracy of the installation. Those number wouldn't change what he did but would have been nice to know just to know them.  Totally agree on the wheel by wheel.  Based on experience, until I weighted the rig, I'd run 100 which covers the 4K max hub rating.  But that's just my opinion.  Here are the Goodyear published pressure chart numbers for the G114 tire so you can make a choice.  I would not run the max of 125 psi regardless.  Again, my opinion.  125 psi is for 4,806 lbs of load.  'Bit much for our rigs, and then some.

110 psi = 4,340 lbs  105 psi = 4,180 lbs  100 psi = 4,020 lbs   95 psi = 3,860 lbs  90 psi = 3,695 lbs.

---

That's what I'm doing ... 100 psi per tire, which I suspect will be what I wind up with.  Not freaked out about the wheel by wheel weights, but very curious.  Thanks, Bill, for your mentorship!

-- Edited by RonC on Sunday 13th of August 2017 04:26:26 PM

-- Edited by RonC on Sunday 13th of August 2017 04:26:54 PM

Well Ron how did the first pull go? Did you feel a dig difference?

Well that toll road should have been a good test

RonC wrote:

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Bill and Linda wrote:

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RonC wrote:

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Bill,

I did request it before ... when I asked the answer from the tech was "I forgot". I requested an "after" weigh and the rig was 3" low in the front (which I noticed after it was pulled out of the bay) and the weights reflect it ... very heavy on the front two axles and light on the two rear ones. Pretty sure the total weight is reliable so that's what I'm going on. You are correct that there is a LOT of metal in those assemblies ... impressive. They also welded a 4" and a 1" box riser tubes to make everything turn out right height wise. This adds strength at the frame to IS attachment area, so pleased about that. Rob told me that the rubber springs will "settle" about 1/2" after they've been in service for a little while. All that to say I'm OK with how level everything is, just need to get it weighed wheel by wheel so I'll know what tire pressures to run.

-- Edited by RonC on Saturday 12th of August 2017 03:41:18 PM

---

 Then the tech didn't do everything you requested, but that doesn't impact accuracy of the installation. Those number wouldn't change what he did but would have been nice to know just to know them.  Totally agree on the wheel by wheel.  Based on experience, until I weighted the rig, I'd run 100 which covers the 4K max hub rating.  But that's just my opinion.  Here are the Goodyear published pressure chart numbers for the G114 tire so you can make a choice.  I would not run the max of 125 psi regardless.  Again, my opinion.  125 psi is for 4,806 lbs of load.  'Bit much for our rigs, and then some.

110 psi = 4,340 lbs  105 psi = 4,180 lbs  100 psi = 4,020 lbs   95 psi = 3,860 lbs  90 psi = 3,695 lbs.

---

That's what I'm doing ... 100 psi per tire, which I suspect will be what I wind up with.  Not freaked out about the wheel by wheel weights, but very curious.  Thanks, Bill, for your mentorship!

-- Edited by RonC on Sunday 13th of August 2017 04:26:26 PM

-- Edited by RonC on Sunday 13th of August 2017 04:26:54 PM

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 Per GY Tech Support.  Weigh each tire if possible or weigh each axle.  Use weight/inflation chart and add 5psi.  I have used this method for years and have gotten excellent tread wear and ride quality.

RonC wrote:

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---

That's what I'm doing ... 100 psi per tire, which I suspect will be what I wind up with.  Not freaked out about the wheel by wheel weights, but very curious.  Thanks, Bill, for your mentorship!

 

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 Your welcome, happy to help as I can.  The info by Cummins I do agree with as per the GY tech.  Use the heaviest wheel weight, go by the charts and then add 5 psi.  And just to be clear for anyone reading along for info, whatever the heaviest wheel is, that is he wheel that sets the air pressure for all tires regardless of the lighter weight on the other tires.  This must be done cold.  Meaning not after moving the rig, before.  Hence the practical need for a 150 psi rated compressor.  Saw them at Lowe's today BTW for $129.00. Porter Cable version.  Works good for the purpose.

Don't be surprised if all you need is 95 psi. And don't be overly concerned about being low or high at this point. It does matter, but not nearly as much with these commercial grade tires for a short time.

BTW, next time your going over a set of railroad tracks see if you don't notice the trailer "echoing" the truck as it goes over the tracks.  First time I pulled the exact same trailer with the IS after upfit that is what I noticed - that I did not feel the trailer's echo bouncing after the truck when over the tracks. 

Safe travels,

Bill

I guess NH did a better job of sizing your springs…M/R swapped out our rubber springs for the next stiffness up on our first visit. 

We had a great visit with MorRyde. In at 6am out by 8am. Everything looked good
5 of the 6 wheels were close one was way off, we are now tracking straight and should have no trailer worries off to Kanas to see the New Horizon wizard for some minor warranty items..
We do seem to be having a truck issue however so we are dropping the truck off at the Ram dealer to get checked out. We seem to be low on coolent but see no leaks and not running hot. It has to be going somewhere, hoping it is not a leaking intercooler for the turbo.
We are in Chatham Ill for the next 12 days so what ever it is hope to get it taken care of while hear.

I do not see anything or smell anything in the oil, but as you said it has to be going somewhere.
Took it to a Ram dealer today, they will look at it Monday morning. What ever it is ,it should be under warranty. But hope it is something simple so that time down is not a issue. So glad we have the extra car, so that will not slow us down while we are here in the Springfield Ill. Area. Looks like there is a lot to do hear.

We don't have any glass's so we will have to watch it on TV I guess.